WHAT'S IN A NAME?
JULIET:
'Tis but thy name that is my enemy;
Thou art thyself, though not a Montague.
What's Montague? it is nor hand, nor foot,
Nor arm, nor face, nor any other part
Belonging to a man. O, be some other name!
What's in a name? that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet;
So Romeo would, were he not Romeo call'd,
Retain that dear perfection which he owes
Without that title. Romeo, doff thy name,
And for that name which is no part of thee
Take all myself.
Anyone else out there a huge Romeo and Juliet fan? The version with Olivia Hussey? LOL I about drove my parents crazy listening to the LP of that movie over and over. I can still quote it in huge chunks. LOL But I digress. I'm actually here to talk about names. I've been thinking about names a lot since my granddaughter will be coming in a few months. What will be her name? My editor Ami McConnell also taught me to think hard about names when writing a new book. So I'm very name focused.
I'll tell you the one piece of advice I give pregnant women then I'd love you to tell me YOUR suggestions about dos and don'ts when it comes to names. My number one DON'T is not to call your child by his/her MIDDLE name. It was the style back in the day and my parents called me and my brother Randy by our middle names. I love my name Colleen because it's different. I have only run into a handful of other Colleens in my life so I like unique names. But I wish it had been my first name. Calling a kid something other than their first name seriously messes with their sense of identity. People can call me Peggy until the cows come home and I won't look. They had to tap me on the shoulder.
Some people think it's fine because the teachers ask what to call the child. Um, no. School is a TINY part of the name disconnect. I'm 56 years old and it's still a huge annoyance. I go to a doctor's office and they call me Peggy. I sit there for fifteen minutes before they call me again and I get it. LOL Any legal documents are in the name of Peggy. It's something that carries through a child's whole life. So don't do it!
Peggy is my mother's name and it's wonderful on her. I can't imagine her as any other name. But it's not ME. I'm Colleen. LOL
So what's your name advice?
Delicious
36 Comments:
I get to be first? Usually I'm chiming in a day later than anyone else. Hmmm.
I have to pass on the advice our Lamaze teacher gave us. Once you think you have the perfect name, go to your back door, open it, and scream the whole name as loud as you can four times. First, middle, last (and anything extra thrown in).
If you still like it, it's a good name. If you don't, change it, because screaming that name is something you're going to be doing a lot of for many years to come!!
...ain't it the truth! :-)
I would advise a new parent not to try and make the name more original with "creative" spelling. You're consigning your child to a lifetime of correcting the misspelling and mispronunciation of their name. And you give the impression that you just didn't know how to spell when you filled out the birth certificate.
Good suggestions, girls! I dislike the creative spelling thing too.
I would suggest that if you want to name a child "Andrew John" (for instance) but call him "A.J.", then just name him A.J.
Or if you don't want your child's name to be shortened, it's probably better to give him or her a one-syllable name or something that can't be shortened. For example, there is a family in our church who has a son named "Joshua." They absolutely do not want anyone calling him "Josh"; (He's now about 7 or 8, so it's tough.) but you just know it's going to happen sooner or later.
Oh, and I agree about the middle name and creative spellings issues. I'm also not a fan of juniors, thirds, fourths, etc. I guess I think it's easier on everyone in the household if the family name to be carried down is used as a middle name or something.
I also think names should be somthing that will sound good on someone when they're old and well as when they're young.
Definitely avoid the creative spellings unless you include a pronunciation key! As a former high school teacher, weird spellings are totally frustrating especially during the first few days of school. Also watch out for rhyming in the name unless you want your child to have a nickname. For example.... JenFen or LeeBee (true versions of first and last name (partial) combinations).
Don't start all your kids' names with the same letter. Worse, don't give them the exact same initials. Until kid #3 and #4 we even put the same number of letters in our kids' names! Well, we didn't even think I could have kids, and then we sure didn't think we'd end up with four, so that's our excuse.
Proud Mom of:
Tarl Adam
Tobi Anne
Trey Andrew
Tavia Amber
What we did right: Gave our kids unusual first names and common middle names. We figured if they hated their weird names, they could always go to plan B (and make Colleen crazy!) Fortunately they all love their names, and they fit our creative, unique kids. (Not crazy about how often we hear "Oh, we had a dog named Tobi" ; } but it does fit our daughter, and it means "The Lord is good" and since she was a long-prayed-for child, it's appropriate. )
My dad has always gone by his middle name and he kind of likes it. If anyone calls asking for Arlon, he knows it's likely a telemarketer.
I like the idea of being able to scream your kids names.
That was always my motto, if it is a good yellin name, it is a good name! In other words, it rolls of our tongue well!
I also concur with the spelling notation. My first daughter we made the mistake of wanting a unique but normal name. Also, it had to look pretty. That was a rule for ALL of my girls.
We found Karalynn. It isn't Carolyn, or Caroline, but Kara Lynn, all one word. I didn't care for just Kara, but put together it was fun. But EVERYONE spells it wrong and she gets alot of Carolyn's, and that highly gets on my nerves.
We also gave all 3 of our girls 2 middle names. It started with our first, when we couldn't decide on a middle name. My middle name is Jean, which isn't the greatest, but is my mother's middle name as well, and I wanted to pass it on. But I really didn't like Karalynn Jean Phillips. It didn't 'yell' good. So we added Abri (pronouced ubrEE). She is Karalynn Jean Abri Phillips. It yells really good:-) Next we have Lacy (L's are such pretty letters to write!), who is Lacy Emma Leigh Phillips (Karalynn liked the name Emma, but EVERY girl for like 2 years was named Emma, so we put it in her middle name...). Last but not least, we have my Gabriella. She is Gabriella Gracie Jo Phillips. We call her Gabby Jo for short (she was born in Nashville, and we felt she needed a good southern sounding nickname!)
So those were my decisions, good or bad as they may be. My rules of thumb were:
1.) Have to be yellable :-)
2.) For girls, have to look pretty when written.
3.) My husband couldn't absolutely hate them (he didn't have to really like them...)
4.) Don't be like my Dr's name that delivered Gabby... His name was Thomas K. Thomas. What was his momma thinking? They called him TJ for short, but still!!!
Our first order of business is to make sure the Monogram is not a foul word, or anything to make fun of.
Stay away from names that have bad history, actual or implied since.
Don't join in the "most popular" name.
I have no middle name, Colleen. I was unique to my generation. Some of the kids had three or four names, beside their surname. My hubby calls his middle name his "trouble" name. He only heard it when he was in Deep Hot Water. He doesn't like his middle name at all. Use all the names more often than when the kid is in trouble.
Finally, stay away from names that have drugs or diseases named for them... Allegra comes to mind.
Pay very close attention to the meaning of the name! It's almost a guarantee that the child will grow into it in some form or fashion. Even God Himself thought name meanings were a big deal. Look at how many He changed throughout the Bible because they were no longer the identity of the person. Names, while not our entire identity, are a big part of it.
I like all your kids' names, Deb. I've always thought they were unique.
Our daughter's name is Kara, Krista. There weren't many around when I named her that.
Chelf, I never thought about a name being a drug like Allegra. Yikes! LOL
Great suggestions all of you. Thanks!
Yah, Kara was the name of pretty much every other girl born around the time she was born. I liked it, in fact had it as one of my 'names to name my girls' when I was growing up, but wanted something unique but not 'wierd'.
DITTO the comment about finding out what the name means to! We lost a baby in between Karalynn and Lacy, and named her Abigail, which means 'A Father's Joy'. I still picture her playing tea parties with Jesus, being the joy of her Heavenly Father. I know they probably don't have little girl tea parties in heaven, but it makes me feel better:-)
I'm super careful about what a name means when naming my characters too. I have a name book that tells what people THINK of when they hear a name.
Watch initials, people. It's scary what some initials end up spelling! Patrick Orville Oberton (POO)*, Stephanie Anne Stratford (SAS)*, etc.
*Names changed to protect the unfortunate
Or some names sounds like diseases (building off the prescription drug name-theme mentioned earlier) - like "Valeria". I still feel like I need to get vaccinated after hearing that name. (Sorry if someone out there has that name and i just offended them!) yikes.
I'm going to stop now! LOL
I LOVE ROMEO AND JULIET with Olivia Hussey! Four years in a row I had to watch the movie when I was teaching R&J to grade 9's. It was PURE DELIGHT! One of my students was so taken by her, he rushed home to "google" her and get some pictures of her. Imagine his surprise and disgust when he found out she was now middle aged! LOL. :)
What a name MEANS is most important in my book. Our adopted daughter's first and middle names mean "Beloved Chosen One."
Make it a name that people can say when they read it or hear it. Our daughter's first name is a Turkish name (since we live in Turkey) and Americans CONSTANTLY mispronounce or misspell it. Poor child. It's been a trial for her.
AT LAST, someone else loves the movie! I was beginning to think I was the only weird one. I was in high school when that movie came out. it is still fabulous!
I love Romeo and Juliet! Not the movie (I haven't seen it yet, though I mean to), but the play script. Shakespeare's writing -- though often cliched nowadays -- is still beantiful and concise.
I tend to like unusual names because they can reflect a child's uniqueness. However, there is a line between unique and just plain weird. Obviously a fifteen letter name that no one can pronounce isn't the best choice.
Also, check the meaning of the names you pick. Sometimes a name sounds beautiful, but then you find out the meaning is something like "duck" or "one who whines". There are even baby name books that give the name, meaning, and a Bible verse referencing the meaning.
Good point about the initials, Jaime. My poor mother's initials spelled WAR before she married. After she married my dad, it got worse. Now her initials are WART! : } Needless to say, she doesn't own anything with a monogram.
Well, ok, I already gave more than my 2 cents, but I have to say it. Don't choose a child's name based on a popular media character. :)
Case in point: A friend of mine named her first child, "Phoebe." Now, there's nothing really wrong with that name, (if you like it) but she chose it because "Phoebe" was her favorite character on "Friends." When her daughter grows up and asks her how Mommy and Daddy picked her name, Mommy can say, "We named you after a ditzy character on a tv show!"
What a legacy! :)
I don't have much advice except don't name the baby after an inanimate object. Apple is not a cute name for a girl no matter what Gwyneth Paltrow says.
The same thing goes for "Laurien", not because its not cute but because people will never pronounce it correctly.
Well, we broke all the rules. My first one uses his middle name, and he's a third, so he's Trey.
Jonah -- who is gentle as a dove as his name means.
Seth -- our third son.
Ellena (The way Eleanor is pronounced in England) I hate the way Americans say it -- incidentally, so does my English friend and her daughter goes by Ellie also here.
My advice is go normal now that I've named my kids. People have a hard time with Bob, "How do you spell that?"
Why wouldn't there be little girl tea parties in heaven?! What about all of the little girls that go to heaven?! What about me, who loves tea? I can't imagine paradise lacking tea.
Umm, anyway. I kind of wish my name was more unique, actually. I want my kids to have names that really flow beautifully and look gorgeous when written out. I can't imagine having a Sarah or a John, etc. My grandpa's name was James Cassen, so I believe that I want to have a boy name Cassen or Casson. I was really close to my Papaw!
I like old fashioned and family names.
My oldest daughter's name is Evangelene (we do call her Evie, though), and it's also unique - she's the only Evangelene/Evie in her whole school. (spoken by one of the bazillion Jenny's on this planet)
My younger daughter's middle name is Quinn, which is my great grandmother's maiden name.
BTW, Colleen, you do *not* look like a Peggy. ;)
I think about some of the really old names and wonder how anyone could look at a sweet baby and name them Buford. Or Archibald. Or Hortense. Or Bertha. Hopefully, none of you have kids named that.
I was gonna say watch the initials, but several others beat me to it. Even looking at how the first initial goes with your last name, especially if your last name starts with a vowel.
And don't try to be "cute". I shudder to think about the things people have had to endure all their lives because their parents thought it would be funny to put a cutesy moniker on them. Like a kid named Topher (both parents are named Chris). And when my hubs was a kid, he knew a preacher named William B. Williams. And yes, the B was Bill. There's even a website that shows some of the worst names people have named their kids as found on U.S. Census databases. . . .like Emma Royd (in 1850, no less!), Anita Bath, Dinner Ware.
I've known a Holly Wood. Someone else knew a Rusty Nail.
But the funniest (which isn't the parent's fault - just the profession they chose) is 2 doctors who are partners in my city: they are urologists who do many men's surgical procedures. Their names?
Dr. Chopp & Dr. Hitt.
I do have to say, I have seen some doosy names in my time. I ditto not to do wierd.
By day I am a payroll manager, so I come across some really strange ones. The worst I think was a Middle eastern name. The man's name was Maboob Hussain. The other 'worst' name I have seen was Bich (please don't think I am swearing there... I am not! It is pronounce BIK). I didn't know that at first, and I worked at a payroll company and was trying to refer to the person to my client, and wasn't sure what to say without cussing at them! I ended up spelling it, and the client laughed. I was so embarressed! Really, what were their parents thinking???
Oh, and then last names are just as bad sometimes. One place I used to live, in the town there was a large family with the last name of "Hell". On their mail box, they had their last name in big letters. I got the shivers everytime I passed their house!!
I love Romeo and Juliet as well!
Hmm...guess I really did all the "no-nos" in naming my kids:
Emily Carol
Remington Case
Isabella Co-Ceaux
Emily goes by Emily or Em (or Emily Carol, when my mother's speaking); Remington goes by Remy, but she asnwers to Remington because that's what I call her unless exasperated or just dead tired; and Isabella's middle name is pronounced CoCo, as in rhyming with no-no. LOL But hey, that's a nod at my French heritage, so there ya go!
I have an unusual name, Winette. When I was a kid, of course no one else had a name like mine. I didn't have a middle name and I felt left out because of it. My Mother thought I'd use my maiden name as my middle name when I married, but NOT! Kids put up with alot of teasing and a really strange name such as Snowflake would not be one I would want to tack on a child. Just my two cents worth. People usually try to make my name into Wynette, as in Tammy Wynette, so I do know what it's like to have an unusual name. (Smile)
Some friends of ours who taught in the greater L.A. area, told us of some kids they had in classes (brothers)..."Orangejello" (pronounced or-ahn-gel-o), and his brother, "Lemonjello" (again lem-ahn-gel-o). My great aunt once taught a girl by the name of Ima Hogg. Back in the 1930's.
I have a cousin who was named after his dad, and always resented being called "Little Rex" with his dad being "Big Rex". Later, because he was the last of the extended family to finally get e-mail, everyone dubbed him "T-Rex".
My mother thought Crystal was the most beautiful name she ever heard. Then, right after she had me (after 5 miscarriages) she had to let me come live with her in-laws because she was ill with TB. My dad's family hated my first name. I think that is why I have unhappy feelings about Crystal. It is a habit to call people by their first and middle names in Tennessee but they never, ever called me Crystal Elaine. Maybe it was too long, too strange and they wanted to name me Sally! (after my great-grandmother--ugh! )
Anyway, my whole life, even after I went back to live with my parents when my mother came out of the TB hospital about 3 years later, I was called Cris or Crissy. Well, wouldn't you know I married a Chris?? That was the end of Cris.
So, I still dislike hearing someone call me Crystal, even though my mother, I think, secretly loved it that I had to revert back to Crystal. Then I found out that my name is more common than dirt(even authors have this name, Crystal Miller.) Can you imagine? I hate that! I've gone by various names on articles and columns, but I haven't a clue what to go by if I sold a book.
I think if the people around you love your name and call you that with affection, you love your own name. I named my first son (of four) Jordan Christopher and planned on calling him Jordy. Well, when he came, he was a Jordan all the way. I can't even imagine calling him "Jordy." Ugh.
Then I had Jared Neil, Bryce Patrick and finally, Max Christian. Max has always had this scowl when people try to call him Maxwell or some variation--"No." he says, "Just Max."
I had a hard time choosing a girl's name, so I have no idea. (That's why God never gave me a girl?) I liked the name Katherine--Kat--but my mother-in-law hates that name. We were going to be in trouble if ever we had girls!
As a former school teacher, I agree that you shouldn't spell the name weird or have some sort of weird pronunciation. I do know a doctor friend who collected weird names of patients. (We all have our hobbies.) Since I taught first grade, short names were good!
I didn't know you were Peggy! I like Colleen quite a lot, so I'm glad you had a middle name that you could use.
This is always a discussion that intrigues and dismays me. Sigh.
It's hard to choose a name for myself, much less for characters. Sigh. (But yes, I have baby name books.)
I love the name Olivia. One of Max's friends is a gorgeous redhead named that. One thing to be cautious about--watch your combinations of initials. Kids have enough trouble without that.
I had to come back. There are too many DON'T rules, and not enough DO rules.
I knew a guy who named his boys Schuyler (say Skylar) Colton and Sterling Christian. And I asked him one day, "What if Sterling turns out to be an Atheist?" I think Christian should be left as a title or a lifestyle choice, not a name.
As for Skylar, or it's fancy cousin Schuyler, please do not use that. I knew a guy who was a rapist named Skylar. So... yeah.
For Valerie: Phoebe could also be a witch from Charmed... and Prue (Prudence) Piper, and Paige. From Friends..."I know it is not my business, but PLEASE don't name the child Phoebo." My niece is Emma, and while her mom is a fan of Friends, Emma is NOT named for Rachel's baby.
I don't like character traits as names... Chastity, Charity, Sunshine, Happy, Patience. What happens when they don't live up? A grouchy baby named Happy is not a good joke. And Justin Case... that is not funny either.
Alliteration is another thing I am planning to avoid. Joel, Jay and Jesse were nice guys, but WOW what a mess when you have to yell at them!
My brother was Jon Ralph. Where does one ralph? In the john. Sorry. Also, our last name was spelled with an E on the end, so he got the misspellings coming and going. People thought he was Jonathan, which he was not.
Believe me, I never knew how many people would try to mess up Michelle. One L or two? Is there an S or a G in there somewhere? Are you named after the song? Nope. Thanks for promoting the Beatles. Or Guns 'N' Roses.
In the end, you have to decide what you want to do, and your child (your BABY of the Book) will have to live with that decision. At least with a child, they can change their name if they choose.
My advice is not to name your kids for a heritage they don't have, especially if you live in the area. I'm my own best example of this.
My parents wanted to name me after their friend, Mary, but didn't want to keep it the same. So they chose the Hawaiian version of Mary, Malia.
Now as a kid, I was blonde and blue eyed. I can't tell you how much grief I got from my classmates, especially Hawaiian ones, about my name.
Don't do it! It makes the poor kids miserable. I certainly was and begged my parents to change my name.
The other piece of advice is not to name a kids for something too common. Malia is like Jenny here. There was always at least one, if not two or more other girls with the same name as me all through school.
Although, I have to admit to not knowing what other name to give myself. I actually like it now, but it took me awhile to get to that point.
i was named bethanie because beth was my mum's favourite character in her favourite book (little women) plus she knew a bethany who was a missionary and very nice. but my DAD said lets' spell it different because melanie, stephanie, etc, all with an IE at the end. so Bethanie it is.
it drives me nuts, even some of my family don't know how to spell my name, my closest friends spell it wrong and it drives me mad! mum told me i'm not allowed to name my children weird names, or give them strange spellings because she's regretted it ever since. however i LIKE the spelling, and although it's annoying, i like my name.
i am a Bethanie Jane. plain middle name. my initials are BJF and will remain the same forever as my fiance's surname also starts with F. hehe.
my name means house of poverty, it's hebrew. or also house of figs. yeah well i don't like figs but i'm always broke, so they shouldn't have named me this! lol!
my aunt's friend is a teacher (along with my aunt, my dad, all my family lol) and once she had this kid in her yr1 class and his mum introduced him as 'gooey' and she was like ookkk weird coz i can't find a gooey on the class list. finally she worked out his name was Guy. the mother had read a book and named the kid after the character but obviously never learnt how to read properly and thought the word was gooey. hahaha! poor kid though.
my dad's step-mum and my dad's brother in law both go by their middle names. but i don't think i'd ever do it.
I'm chiming in wa-a-ay late on this but I have to add one more 'no-no'- and that is to not give your baby a nickname that doesn't exist on the birth certificate. My name is not Peggy, although I love it and rarely call myself anything else. I'm told my mother started calling me Peggy even before I was born, and that was in the days before ultrasound and the unborn baby's gender was a surprise at birth.
But my real, legal name is Margaret. Middle name Claire. All through my school years I had to fight to get the teachers to call me Peggy and accept homework turned in with Peggy on it, but my report cards all had Margaret. I hated it and for years refused to respond when it was used.
Now, of course, I must use it on all legal stuff, and I've forced myself to respond to Margaret at the doctor's office. It's too much effort to fight for the rights of Peggy. LOL
My own children are:
Douglas Noble
Heidi Beth
Kevin Scott
The only one who's name got shortened was Doug.
I'm late, but I want to play, too.
I just looked up the meaning of my name. It's Greek for black. Not all that enlightening.
As a copy editor forced to read obituaries five days a week, I advise against naming your child anything that would make a copy editor call the funeral home when seeing it in a suvivors list. One of tonight's examples: a granddaughter named Myrle. I thought for sure it was Myrtle, but no. And that's a nice one. I've also seen a name in an obit with a question mark in the middle of it.
My niece is Mary Elizabeth Wood and answers to Mary, Mary Elizabeth, Sissy, Miss Liz, Mary Beth and more. At least it allows for different names for different moods.
And in all that discussion, you notice no one pointed out that the poor girl in Romeo and Juliet was stuck with the last name Hussey? Was she brazen?
Melanie Lynn Jones
This has everyone I work with visiting babynameworld.com.
And I forgot to tell my favorite name story: A husband and wife who taught at my college were both named Opal. Both had doctorates, so they were Dr. and Dr. Opal Lovett. I know their daughters had gem names, I think Ruby and Pearl.
i babysat some kids who's neighbours were italian their names were dominic and dominica. at least it was the husband and wife, not the kids!!!
they went by dom and dommi.
So far everyone here seems to have really great advice.
At one of my first jobs where there were many young people my age, I was one of three Sarah Elizabeth's, all spelled exactly the same way. I know my mother thought it was the most beautiful name ever, but apparently so did everyone else.
I always hated my maiden name though: Penica (pronounced penn-ick-uh). There are endless ways to butcher the pronunciation. I was determined that I would definitely marry-up when it came to my last name. I ended up with Romine (as in you row your boat, and I'll row-mine). I get a lot of romaine (like the lettuce) or a foreign-ish accent on the "mine," both of which I find very irritating. I threatened to hyphenate when I got married, so as to really frustrate the world, but I decided I'd probably only frustrate myself.
I also agree with not using names that are associated with a specific heritage if it is not your own. We once knew a family who had recently come over from Korea. Their children, Hun-hee and Hun-jin (probably spelled that wrong) were both given American names before they started school. Hun-hee got off easy with Esther, which was really cute because she was excited about her American name and it being from the Bible, so for a while she insisted everyone call her Princess Esther. Hun-Jin, ended up being dubbed Jerardo. Now I don't think his parents, whose English was still pretty limited, had any idea they were not picking an "American" name, but I have to wonder what his kindergarten teacher thought when she called out the name Jerardo on the first day of school and found an adorable little Asian boy raising his hand. I have to wonder if he still goes by the "American" name or has switched back to his original Korean name.
My only other tip is to pick a name that is clearly masculine or feminine. I work in the student financial aid industry, and when I have to send a letter to a student and cannot determine their gender, I find myself frequently resorting to a lot of letters that begin simply "Dear Student:"
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